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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 7:56 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:31 pm
Posts: 53
Lost,

I have a question or two, and you've probably answered this at some point, I may have even read it, but have forgotten. Getting old....

A number of the items I scrap are the old 3 CRT, rear projection TVs, rear projection DLP TVs etc.

More often than not, there is the cable "In" or tuner box attached to a PCBD that has a lot of components on it; ICs and so on. This is especially true when the TV is high end, and has all the bells and whistles of the day.The cable "In" box is the one that has all of the metal RF shielding wrapped around it and is solidly anchored/soldered to the circuit board actually being graded. When this box is still attached to a heavily populated PCBD, does the metal box degrade the PCBD? I know the grading of most PCBDs is related to the copper content and not so much the PM content until a board hits Telco or higher. I also understand the larger transformers, large capacitors and large heat sinks should be removed from the boards. So again, would removing the cable "In" box be of any added value in perhaps moving a particular board up in grade? Or, are most all boards of the type I'm describing never going to really get much higher than say, peripheral? Or, if a board is graded mid-grade, would removing the cable "In" box move the board up to peripheral? Is it preferred that the metal, cable "In" boxes are removed from the PCBDs?

One last question...

I submitted a number of pictures of gold finger PCBDs and you graded them for me. Very much appreciated by the way. I asked this question in my original post with the GF boards, but not sure I got the answer I was looking for.

About half of the Gold Finger boards I submitted pictures of have a significant number of gold pins on them. I'm collecting gold pins when I can and separating them. Concerning the Gold Finger boards. Can I trim all of the gold pins from all of the Gold Finger boards and not take a hit on the grade? Is this a no-no? Would there be instances when I would not want to trim the gold pins from the Gold Finger boards?

Thank you,

RustyFuryIII

P.S. - I'm sure I'll have more questions as I progress!!!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:39 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:57 pm
Posts: 4782
Location: Low DOS
On the assumption that the “in” box you reference is the RF input port and converter in a thin metal hoisin... it’s rarely worth focusing on that. Much like old video game and 4/8 bit computer boards that one of the afterthought components in recycling. With tube TVs the vast majority of power on board motherboards, the big massive single board units with ICs, cables, and transformers etc attached, are going to be mid grade 99% of the time. And nothing you’d remove could bump it up in value.
Very high end tube TVs, and computer monitors, especially “flat tube” units, have the potential to make it to peripheral with a bit of work.
Youdthave to remove the massive transformers and large capacitors, shields, wires, etc. Removing the RF converter won’t hurt, but is unlikely to help either.

As for pins I’m not sure what I said in reference to the posted boards.
Boardsort, and all escrap companies, generally frown upon cherry picking items of value from the boards. The class value is based on the average value of boards. Much like a company that pays a special rate for transformers averages the value of large copper strip shields in high voltage against the plastic weight of brick transformers in price, Boardsort values the average pin weight on many gold finger cards as part of the offer.
Will they dock an individual person of a single card? Probably not. 20, 10, 5 cards with cut pins, someone is going to notice. Not sure if they’ll dock you down on that or not. But if 50 people cut the pins on just one card each that’s a massive value loss for Boardsort, and the class value will depreciate considerably after a week or two.
Then you get the domino issues where the lower prices make people remove more, driving prices lower, etc; where eventually the value of gold finger cards isn’t much better than peripheral.
Those scrapping long enough in escrap remember the price crash when the industry changed from ATA/SCSI to SATA/SAS on drive controllers like DVD and Hard Disk cards. The loss there was the same as this hypothetical loss of pins on finger cards. The only reason hard drive boards still hold the current hard drive value today is due to Apple and HP who held on to SCSI until a few years ago; there’s still a large volume of SCSI drive boards coming into the scrap market. With the end of XP/2008 on the windows side and the coming death of 32-bit MacOS the SCSI bubble is going to pop in the next 2 years and then hard drive boards will quickly drop to near telco if not be merged outright.

So... my ultimate suggestion is don’t. You could make a bit more short term money doing so, but you’re hurting the very industry and people you are depending on.

_________________
-- my grades are my own and do not represent an offer from boardsort, nor are they guaranteed. Please keep that in mind.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:42 am 

Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:31 pm
Posts: 53
Lost,

Thank you for answering my questions.

Yes, the board with the RF Input port and convertor. I learned a new term in the electronics world, "hoisin"? I think that's what you wrote? When I looked that word up, I came up with "sweet, tangy sauce"? Pour it on! I guess....!

Anyway, glad to know I can leave those on, pita to take them off, however, stacking them in a box with other boards becomes more challenging!

Also, with regards to the pins on gold finger cards and my question regarding cutting the gold pins. My intent was not to short change Boardsort or anyone else. I'm still trying to get a handle on what I can and can't do to try and maximize profit on my end (if any, ha!) without jeopardizing what Boardsort can get on their end.

Thank you again for getting back to me with your insightful commentary, it is very much appreciated.

Regards,

RustyFuryIII


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:37 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:57 pm
Posts: 4782
Location: Low DOS
Housing, naughty Siri.

I wasn’t trying to imply shorting as an intention.
It’s more of an industry issue in general.
A small company I sell some electronic components to like lead acid batteries and capacitors, was the highest payer I knew of for BGA chips for many years. $10-$14 per lb a few months ago. They stopped taking them completely now.
People were removing bridge chips and I/O chips from old 486/Pentium era boards and double dipping. The company themselves didn’t really care until they recently changed their buyer and got docked in the value for the lesser boards.
Their massively over sorted schedule of classes went from many many dozens to two nearly overnight. They now take low and high. Low is anything Chris would consider peripheral and below.
A motherboard or a telco card or a hard drive controller is high.
Low boards get 30 cents and high get $1.50.
Ouch
The big thing of note in the example is that removing anything, a single chip, a single PIN, drops a board to low.

The iron yard I use used to be one of the highest paying for cars. Far beyond any cash and tow company. They were paying a high end CBM rate (over $1 per pound) because rather than crush them and sell the blocks they dissected and shredded them on site. When people started pulling exhaust systems and radios they created a partial car price at half the value. Problem for salvage people is the rate is the same if you remove the Catalytic converter or engine block or a door lock mechanism.

It’s not so much as lecturing people on what to do and not do for me, as pointing out the possible side effects of doing so.
I’ve been scrapping for a LONG time and have grown to good friends with many on both sides of the business. But I’ve also seen what SOME people (NOT you) are willing to do for a few extra pennies (D type Lithium dry cell batteries in an empty 40 ounce can), and the near fatal result from it.
Sending a single sealed iPhone in a giant gayloard of battery-less phones. Boom
Cutting a single pin. Removing a chip. Sticking a peripheral board in 50 lbs of telco.
Again it’s not meant to be a reprimand, just a view from the other side of the counter.

_________________
-- my grades are my own and do not represent an offer from boardsort, nor are they guaranteed. Please keep that in mind.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:48 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:31 pm
Posts: 53
Lost,

No worries, I didn’t think you were reprimanding me. I always look forward to what you have to say. I too would like to, over the coming years, develop a great working relationship with thoses I scrap for and scrap with. You’ve been a great soucre of knowledge to me and my family.

One thing that has occured to me as I’ve trundled down the road of eWaste, is that I’ve noticed our technology has, is and will continue to advance at a startling pace. And as such, the tech we relied on as little as a few short years ago, is considered “antique” in relatively short order. So, I’m collecting items I find interesting, unique, common and not so common from the eWaste stream as it passes thru my hands. I have a pretty decent de-soldering station, and use it on occasion to carefully remove select items from PCBDs as I see them, with the understanding I’m devaluing the board eScrap wise and will definately make note of the missing components to you and/or Boardsort. I’ll then ensure the board is properly placed and labeled prior to shippment/delivered.

Regards,

RFIII


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:46 pm 

Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:57 pm
Posts: 4782
Location: Low DOS
Thanks for the kind words
Again it’s not about any one person, it’s the general public at large who may stumble across this in a few years.
And I’m guilty myself of pulling the occasional part, simply because it’s kool.
Most people don’t even know what a 4004 is at this point, but it’s code is in every PC and Mac out there!
Just about every cell phone since the Motorola flip brick of 1992 has an 8080 chip implementation. Right up to the iPhone X max. New cars today have a Z90 implementation, a slightly reduced functionality Pentium 1, created by Zylog.
How many modern microwave ovens run on an E486sX cpu?!?
With a little electrical know how you can solder the 486 from a microwave into an original 486 motherboard and boot it right up!
That last nugget is why I keep pleading with scrapers to test and sell first.
Kids born between 1960 and 1980 are well versed in Frankensteining electronics.
Just because technology marches on does NOT make yesterday obsolete.
My what’s inside it posts are occasionally personal curiosity; but the vast majority wind up being posted because they were botched repairs ( or simply too expensive to fix). What you find though inside modern stuff is really interesting. A smart bulb uses an i860? Most people even in the computer industry have no idea what it is, if they have even heard about it. Intel’s bastard child that was tossed out for the unrelated 960. Yet 30-some years later it’s in every NFC device.
Wow, I’m ranting. Oh well!
;)

_________________
-- my grades are my own and do not represent an offer from boardsort, nor are they guaranteed. Please keep that in mind.


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